UCM 016: Dr. Ian Davis-Tremayne about Creating an Upper Cervical Revolution and Building the Practice of Your Dreams




UCM 016: Dr. Ian Davis-Tremayne about Creating an Upper Cervical Revolution and Building the Practice of Your Dreams


Dr. Ian Davis-Tremayne about Creating an Upper Cervical Revolution and Building the Practice of Your Dreams

Since 2008, Dr. Ian Davis-Tremayne, D.C. has been fortunate to see thousands of clients in his personal clinic, Upper Cervical Chiropractic of Marin in Mill Valley, Ca, his hometown.  His personal mission is to change as many lives as possible, whether the client can afford care or not.

Dr. Tremayne was one of these clients himself.  Suffering from years of Insomnia since childhood, he was blessed to receive a Knee-Chest Upper Cervical adjustment that changed his life forever. Thus allowing him to live a life medication free and inspiring him to share this gift with the rest of the world.  With the love and support from his wife and son, Dr. Tremayne has been blessed with building the practice of his dreams.

Dr. Tremayne graduated with honors from Life Chiropractic College West.  Dr. Tremayne studied the Knee-Chest Upper Cervical Technique through the true masters of today, in order to deliver the most specific life changing adjustment available.

Dr. Tremayne is also co-founder of The Upper Cervical Revolution, where he travels the world training other Chiropractors and Chiropractic Students how to become the future leaders in the Upper Cervical community. He also organizes Chiropractic mission trips every year to serve the less fortunate.

Dr. Davis: Since 2008, Dr. Ian Davis-Tremayne has been fortunate to see thousands of clients in his personal clinic, Upper Cervical Chiropractic of Marin in Mill Valley, California, his hometown. His personal mission is to change as many lives as possible whether the client can afford care or not.

Dr. Tremayne was one of these clients himself, suffering from years of insomnia since childhood. He was blessed to receive knee-chest upper cervical care that changed his life forever allowing him to live a medication-free life, and inspiring him to share this gift with the rest of the world. With love and support from his wife and son, he's been blessed with building the practice of his dreams.

Dr. Tremayne graduated with honors from Life Chiropractic College West and studied the knee-chest upper cervical technique with some of the true masters of today in order to deliver the most specific life-changing adjustment available.

Dr. Tremayne is also the co-founder of the Upper Cervical Revolution, where he travels the world, training other chiropractors and chiropractic students how to become the future leaders in the upper cervical community. He also organizes chiropractic mission trips every year to serve the less fortunate.

Welcome Dr. Ian!

Dr. Tremayne: Thanks man!

Insomnia Introduced Dr. Ian Davis-Tremayne to Upper Cervical

Dr. Davis: Awesome. So, I want to talk a little bit about your background. Since I have never interviewed you before tell me about this recovery that you had from insomnia through upper cervical.

Dr. Tremayne: Yeah! Well, I've been under chiropractic since as a kid. So, since I was four, full spine, had a great chiropractor. He was a Reggie Gold fanatic, and he is also subluxation-base. He always had the idea of course that you don't always need an adjustment just because you walked into the office. So, I kinda always understood the idea of holding through chiropractic.

When I got into chiropractic school, I don't know, I guess I'm not trying to like this on school or anything, but you're taught pretty much you adjust no matter what.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: You're manipulated no matter what.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: So, as a kid I suffered from insomnia since like bad insomnia. I couldn’t fall asleep. I can’t stay asleep. I was medicated since I was 8 years old, and I would sleep two to three hours a night on meds, and that was pretty normal for me, and the older I got the more meds I took.

Dr. Davis: Wow.

Dr. Tremayne: I would take like I just triple, quadruple the meds. I'd wake up, take more meds and I was doing this all through chiropractic school even, and in the very last, almost my last quarter of school at Life West. My pod doc, the doc I worked under in the clinic.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: He was Dr. Tescarino. He was a knee-chest guy from the Kale Doc and we intend to banter and argue about philosophy daily, because I was really into full spine and BGI kind of work, and he's very specific with just upper cervical?

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: I mean, he eventually heard me talking about my insomnia, and asked me if I would be okay to get checked and adjusted. I was like, absolutely.

So, he adjusted me at my atlas, left, did x-rays and all that, and I was in ASLA. He rocked me. I fell asleep, and since then I just haven’t taken meds, and I have bad nights, of course, and typically the bad nights start when I'm not holding, and I'm ready to get adjusted again. It does is not my indication whether or not I should get adjusted because we do scans and all the objective stuff but it does give me an idea of like odd.

I'm definitely getting ready to get checked, but I don't take meds anymore. It's phenomenal, and it led me on to knee-chest…

Dr. Davis: Awesome.

Dr. Tremayne: …that my whole world flipped with chiropractic like I was going straight up like I said,’full spine BGI’ and then I completely turned in upper cervical, and all its great though. I think all of chiropractic is incredible as long as it's true chiropractic and it's subluxation-based and done by hand, and I think it's amazing.


Building the Upper Cervical Practice of Your Dreams

Dr. Davis:  Alright. So, awesome. So, you came out of Life West and you talked about that you've been able to build the practice of your dreams. Talk to us about what does that mean to you and what does that look like.

Dr. Tremayne: Well, I always had this idea that everyone deserves care no matter what. Health care, not even just chiropractic but health care in general. So, when I was do my bachelor's, my bachelor's was in Health and Social Change, and my thesis was based around the 56 million people are uninsured, and how they're just as everything's going to crap.

So, I always wanted to build a clinic or an office to where people can come in and get checked or worked on or whatever it ends up being because I didn't know if I’d be a chiropractor yet, but I wanted everyone to be able to afford care in whatever way they could, and so I wanted to build a clinic that you walked into and immediately when you walk into, you feel like you're in a healing path, and if you walk in our clinic, it's beautiful. Like we have a beautiful clinic nothing on the walls just chiropractic. We have no, like scary degeneration posters anywhere. Literally nothing is chiropractic in our office except for like my spine model in the corner of my office, and like my personal office, but I want people to walk in not feel bombarded with kind of scare tactics, and it's kind of Zen, like it's kind of weird word but it's Zen. You walk in, you feel calm, feel collected, and you're ready to be served, and we have a lot of people come in and they just like to hang on our lounge, and whether they get adjusted or checked or whatever, they still enjoy being there.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: I wanted to create that community-based feeling where people can rent out our space and they could have talks, they could have classes. We do our revolution class there when it's in the Bay Area, but no matter what whether, like for instance, we're in the richest County in the whole country at this point, like that's where I live, and majority of the people I see can afford full rate, like they don't need a discount, but the people who do need a discount are taken care of because the people who don't need the discount are helping supply that, and it's kind of a socialist world in our office but everybody knows. I offer a sliding scale if needed to everybody. So, they all know it's a possibility if they absolutely needed it, and if you pull up in a beautiful Tesla or a Ferrari, I still mentions sliding scale, and most people are like, ‘No, no. I'm good,’ and they're fine, but the other people who need it, they're really appreciative of that, and they don't get less care. They don't get less of less energy of me. They get care just like anybody else would.

Why are They Called ‘Clients’ Not ‘Patients’?

Dr. Davis: Interesting. So, yeah, I heard you say several times clients. So, why is it? Why are they clients not patients?

Dr. Tremayne: Well, patients is kind of a sick word, like when you're a patient of somebody, you’re typically being treated for something, and we like people to feel immediately like they're in the healing path or enough. In fact, I like people to feel like nothing's wrong with them, that they're just experiencing a human experience, and we're just trying to help them along the way, so they can live optimally within that experience. So, calling them a client is more of a business tactic in a way of making them feel comfortable immediately, and most people see an upper cervical chiropractor after they've seen everybody else.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: All they say is, they've seen everybody else…

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: …including chiropractors, like they've seen full spine chiropractors. They've seen the guys who don't do chiropractic or chiropractors, and then they come to you and they're like, this is my last hope.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: So, when they've been dealing with people treating them like a sick patient this whole time, then they come to us and I'm like, ‘You're just a buddy of mine. Let's take care of you. You're my client now.’

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: It's more nonchalant. It's more calm. It’s more collected, and people feel more willing to go through the process because they trust you as a person on the same level. For instance like, I was originally trained to stand over somebody when talking about a care plan, so they feel like you're more superior to them, and I was trained that if they couldn't afford care that you say, ‘Well, when health is your priority, I'll be here.’ Like that's the stuff I was trained to do in this coaching crap I was doing originally, and it never felt good.

That feels terrible, and it feels terrible for them, but also feels terrible me because it’s not genuine.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: So, we try to take that all out, and it's like, ‘You're here, obviously we see a lot of people are doing great. We're only referral-based at this point. You should be here. There's no reason why you shouldn’t,’ and that's how we roll.

Sliding Scale for Clients

Dr. Davis:  Cool. Very cool. So, you talked a little bit about this already. So, talk more about this sliding scale that you use for clients who can afford your full rate. Can you talk more about how you do that, and how you communicate that?

Dr. Tremayne:  Yes. So, it depends on state too. So, you have to kind of go within state rules and regulations. This is more of a Dr. Sid Williams thing. I was a DE. My very first DE, and it was his last DE. It was my first DE, and he was speaking and then, it also just like, ‘Hit me, like everybody deserves care, everybody.’ There's no reason why nobody should walk in and then walk out because they can't afford it. So, how we do it, is I go through a normal care plan depending on whatever I recommend somebody, and not everybody gets the same plan.

You're not on like a three times a week, six month plan, right?

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: So, but let's just say theoretically, this is a 21-visit plan. I denied I like to work in three months. Within those three months, I offer care and I show them the true value of care. So, full rate. You have 21 visits for $95 a visit. It equals, I think it's $1,995, okay?

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: And then, I have payment options. Those payment options are either upfront, which is 10% off. You get 10% off. Most people by the way are referred. I'd say probably 95% of our people are referred in. So, I give anyone who's referred in 10% off already, and then they get 10% off for paying up front, and then they can take whatever the first number was, and paid off in three months. That's another option. So, you have three monthly installments, okay?

If we were to go per visit, if you want to pay per visit, legally, we can't give you a discount at all. It's not allowed. So, how we work this out in general to get any discount is we have to give you free visits out of the 21.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: So, for instance, if you do your, I think it's the option ‘A’, which is our first option paying up front, you get four free visits. Option ‘B’, you get two free visits, and then per visit, you get no free visits. So, that's how we roll. You can give free care. You can't give discounted care.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: Now, if someone needs sliding scale, I work on good faith, and it's kind of a karmic way of dealing with things that I pretty much tell them. I said, ‘Listen, you get this amount of care no matter what. Twenty-one visits, you're going to have three months to pay it off, and your three monthly installments, you and I are going to find a number that's comfortable for you and comfortable for me financially.’ Overhead wise and then as a patient, and I always tell them most of the time is typically five. I think it's five ninety something. Most of the time people are paying around $400 a month. They get the same amount of care but they're doing it for $1,200 instead of $1,995, okay?

They don't owe anything beyond that. So, they don't owe anything until the 21 visits are up. So, if they use 21 visits, and actually take six months to use or 21 visits, they don't owe anything more until they're done with their care. That's it, and the extra that's owed, like if I think it's about 700 bucks is owed, we write that off. We write that off as free visits.

Dr. Davis: Got you.

Dr. Tremayne: Now, the tricky part though is whether or not you trust somebody if they can afford it or not, and how do you judge that?

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: …and someone can pull up in a beautiful car and which they do, majority of the time.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: People with amazing car and immediately you're judging them that they have money, but realistically to them that might be like a $1,200 payment a month that they are stuck with now.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: So, in my heart of hearts I just say, ‘Listen, I believe in karma. If you can afford it, great. If you can't, this is how we do it, and it's okay, and we probably run our sliding scale as probably a quarter of our practice. Most people aren't sliding scale, but as a quarter of the practice, and it's fine with me, and I tell people have listened to, ‘Since you're on this plan, when you refer people in, which you will because everybody does, I really hope that you don't tell them what your deal is, so they don't come in expecting that,’ and people respect it. It's amazing like, I'm okay with people know we're sliding scale. It's on our website but I'm not okay with people telling everyone, ‘Oh, I pay $300 a month or I pay $400 a month.’

Do You Find Any Diminishment of the Value of Your Care?

Dr. Davis:  Right. Yeah, and so, with that do you find that there's any diminishment of the value of your care?

Dr. Tremayne: No.

Dr. Davis: For those that are on the sliding scale?

Dr. Tremayne: Not at all, and I think the value of care comes from me as a doctor not the price per visit. Now, I'm not a big fan of membership practices for instance. Like $69 a month, you get unlimited care. I think that can diminish the value of care for sure, and people are going to show up every single day because I can.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: The value, I present the value to them. This is how much it actually costs. I always do that. No matter who you are, you're going to know this is how much your care is worth, and then we work with the sliding scale if necessary, but I think the value actually comes from me and how I educate them and also how I feel about it. So, if I feel like my care is being devalued, then there's an issue but I don't. I think that we're doing just fine, and we make good money. We're a very successful practice, and we do it even with this and in tow.

So, but yeah, I think that if I was doing a membership practice, though I think that's where you start teetering the lines of value and not.

Dr. Davis: Got you, and so, and you've been in practice now for about eight years?

Dr. Tremayne: Yeah.

Dr. Davis: And so, and what would about how many patient visits are you seeing per week?

Dr. Tremayne:  Per week, that's a good question. So, we see roughly 70 to 80 a day. We do three days a week. What's that?

Dr. Davis: Got you, 240. So, you say about 25 percent of those are on this type of sliding scale?

Dr. Tremayne:  Roughly. Yeah and depends on the months too.

Dr. Davis: Got you.

Dr. Tremayne: Oh, that's another thing. I also tell them, ‘Listen, it can change per month if next month you end up having a lot of cash, we'd love if you threw it into the pot.

Dr. Davis: Got you.

Dr. Tremayne: …and a lot of people do. They're actually cool with it, and they'll throw an extra two hundred, and actually evens them out to where they should have been.

The Upper Cervical Revolution

Dr. Davis: Very cool. All right, so let's shift now away from the practice. Let's talk about the Upper Cervical Revolution and what you're doing there. Just tell people about what that's all about?

Dr. Tremayne: So, Upper Cervical Revolution is a knee-chest training program. It's kind of started, it accidentally started I should say, with there's a high demand for knee-chest where we were but there wasn't much of a supply. So, we started having a lot of students hanging out the office during the time, and one of the docs who worked with me, he and I would hang out with these students and train them, and they were saying I want to learn. We're like, ‘Okay.’ So, we're spending a lot of time after hours showing them things, and it came to us like, ‘Well, we've been through, I think at that point we've been through three training programs already.’ We're like, ‘Why don't we just compile something and make it worthwhile for everybody, and also affordable, and we'll create a system or a program.’

So, we created a five module program, and every single module you work on adjusting, and that was the one thing I think was lacking through most of the programs that we did, is that you had like, X-ray module, scanning tomography module, and then you had adjusting module, and that's how was he never touched adjusting until he got to adjusting module.

Well, I don't think that creates a very great adjuster, I should say or bone mover because the art is kind of not built, and a lot of people have a hard time with any upper cervical technique because of how you use your body.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: So, we start creating it to where we start with toggle for instance on module one and then we build from toggle all the way to the very last module where you prove yourself through your adjustment, and we build it, and every single week, every student has to post a video of themselves on a private Facebook that all the instructors can critique, but also all the other students can critique as well, and like for instance every Tuesday, I post up and say, ‘Listen, your listing is AS22LA3,’ and everybody has to do a video of that, and then we can critique it, but what we've noticed is that over the last few years of doing this, is that everybody is different body type. Not everyone adjust the same. Not everyone uses their core the same.

So, we modify the adjustment based off the student to them. It's all the same basics but we now help you create where you can be more powerful from within.

In the meantime, we're still going through x-ray, like we have an x-ray module, tomography module and neurology module, history and philosophy module, and then our final module is all business and systems and we give you everything that we use in our clinics, and help you learn how to communicate within your clinic, like how to do a report findings or financials. How to do your exam. How to take x-rays specifically actually take them, not just see us do it.

So, yeah. So, we created a very in-depth program but it stretched out over a period of time to where you can build yourself. So, you walk away feeling pretty confident what you're about to do.

Dr. Davis: Cool.

Dr. Tremayne: You don't have to keep taking it over and over and over again to somewhat feel confident.

Dr. Davis: Right. So, so it's the technique side and the philosophy side but it's also the business side as well.

Dr. Tremayne: Yes.

Dr. Davis: Very cool and how long is the program?

Dr. Tremayne: It's five modules.

Dr. Davis: Okay.

Dr. Tremayne: It kind of depends on where you take it though. Like if you take it in the Bay Area where I am, I do it over five months. So, one module month.

Dr. Davis: Got you.

Dr. Tremayne: …and we have three other locations now. So, we have Saint Louis, Atlanta and Dallas, and in those places, we do two modules per weekend a month apart, and then the final module, we do also a month after that. So, three months’ worth, and that's just because of travel. It's just easier to do it that way…

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: …for wherever the instructor is, and we have a board of directors now. So, it's not just me teaching it, like every location, we have someone who's in charge of that location now.

Chiropractic Mission Trips

Dr. Davis: Very cool. Yeah. I'm going to put a link to this in the show notes for anybody that's interested in checking out the Upper Cervical Revolution, and then also just want to talk about your Chiropractic Mission Trips too. Can you talk about those?

Dr. Tremayne: Yeah. So, we've always wanted to do mission trips out of the country, and that a lot of people do that, because you can get a lot of hands-on work. Go to Costa Rica or wherever and put a lot of people do that, like there's great ones that go to Peru. There's really good ones that go to El Salvador, Costa Rica. There's one that went to Ghana, West Africa but what about us? What about America?

So, I personally run a mission trip every year to San Quentin prison, and in fact we go August 19th this year, and it's not just Upper Cervical. It's welcome to anybody. The only thing is that, it has to be chiropractic. It can't be ART or something, and every year, I organized this trip, and we go to San Quentin, and we have 33 chiropractors that I take. So, because 33 is our number.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: And majority of them are hip or spine and then we have about seven knee-chest upper cervical, and so everybody goes through every, I'm going to say prisoner, but we like to call them men. Every guy goes through and sees a full spine chiropractor first, then they come and get scanned by the new chesters, and then new chesters will adjust if necessary.

Now, the unfortunate part of course just like any mission trip, we don't have x-ray. We can't bring our digital infrared. We have to only bring an NCM.

So, we do the best with what we got, but we do a pretty damn good job, I got to tell you, and I'd say that maybe upper cervical wise, we probably adjust about two-thirds of the guys as opposed to what you would think. I don't know. I say, we've adjust about two-thirds.

Dr. Davis: Very cool, and how long have you been doing that?

Dr. Tremayne: I’ve been doing for I think this can be my seventh year, and I've been organizing it for the past four.

Dr. Davis: …and I'm sure the guys at the prison really appreciate it, huh?

Dr. Tremayne: Oh yeah. Others don’t.

Dr. Davis: Yeah.

Dr. Tremayne: Yeah. It's actually done through like a health fair.

Dr. Davis: Okay.

Dr. Tremayne: …and this health fair has like nursing students, medical students, acupuncture, yoga, dentists. They have the most random stuff, but the guys line up starting at 6:00a.m. for the chiropractors, and the average, we see 800 people in about two and a half to three hours.

Dr. Davis: Wow!

Dr. Tremayne:  Yeah. So, we're just whipping through it. So, as much as we can, we do it until either we run out of people in line or they tell us to leave.

Dr. Davis: Wow! Very cool. Well, a little wrap-up Dr. Ian but before we go, I just want to give you an opportunity to just share anything, encouragement with our doctors and students that listen to the podcast. Just give me an opportunity to do that.

Words of Encouragement

Dr. Tremayne: Yeah. I'd say especially with students and brand new docs, I've started mentoring a few. We get a lot of people through revolution. You want to kind of go through a mentorship of like, opening their practice or how can they make their practice better, and I say mentorship because I think most of the time the coaching world is a little skewed and it has the wrong intentions. So, as a mentor and I am highly recommending you go find someone as a mentor not a coach, and someone who wants to see you do well to help you walk through every step of the way to build your practice to the point where you don't need them. I'm not a big fan of people going out and just going like, ‘I know what I'm doing. I'm good,’ and if you feel like you're that person, like you going to step out there and go like, ‘I got this.’ I think you're probably really, really, really needs a mentor.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: …and so, I want to encourage people to find that person. Well, it could be me but it could be many other people, and if you already feel you got that person, you haven't spoken to them in a while because it's school kind of brings you in, and keeps in this little bubble and you're stuck in like that. I'm really good at adjusting people but I'm not getting much business mentorship. You got to start learning business…

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: …because we need more chiropractors out there, and we need successful chiropractors. If an Upper Cervical person opened up down the street, I'd be stoked, because I know that we'll do well and they'll do well, as long as I do the right things. We just need more people out there because it's too many chiropractors getting out there and failing in their first few years…

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: …and it makes me really sad. It really bums me out because obviously, we need more chiropractors. So, that's what I would say, and be freaking awesome at what you do. Don't just like do everything because everything like, even if you feel like you've done every system or every technique possible, and you're going to throw it all in there. I'd say be amazing at one of them and be known for that thing.

Dr. Davis: Right.

Dr. Tremayne: …like we're known for upper cervical, I should say in our county we’re the Upper Cervical guys, and I've been through every type of technique you possibly think of throughout school, and I can utilize it if I really needed to or I can refer out, because I know what each technique does but be awesome at something, because if you're an expert at one thing then you're going to actually grow huge beautiful practice.

If you're everything to everybody, that's going to be very, very watered-down.

Dr. Davis: Absolutely. Awesome. I appreciate your time today.

Dr. Tremayne: For sure.

Dr. Davis: Yeah. I think we got a lot of value out of this, and that message really resonates with me. I'm such a big proponent of mentoring and talk about that all the time on this podcast. So, hopefully more doctors would commit to that and become mentors or mentor others because we need lots of really good Upper Cervical Chiropractor out there.

Dr. Tremayne: Yeah, for sure. I appreciate you having me man. It’s been an honor.

Dr. Davis: Awesome.

Links discussed in the call


UCM 016: Dr. Ian Davis-Tremayne about Creating an Upper Cervical Revolution and Building the Practice of Your Dreams
UCM 016: Dr. Ian Davis-Tremayne about Creating an Upper Cervical Revolution and Building the Practice of Your Dreams
UCM 016: Dr. Ian Davis-Tremayne about Creating an Upper Cervical Revolution and Building the Practice of Your Dreams
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